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Change the law or Insurance companys to refuse cover. |
Leave things as they are. |
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75% |
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Change the law. |
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16% |
[ 4 ] |
Insurance companys to refuse cover. |
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8% |
[ 2 ] |
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Total Votes : 24 |
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The Teacher Cabbage club member #2
Joined: 17 Mar 2009 Posts: 2118 Location: Playing with traffic
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 11:18 pm Post subject: Bike clothing. Poll |
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Ive been around bike for to many years to mention. There are 2 main things that cheese me of in the bike world.
1 The lack of protective clothing on people riding motorbikes.
2 People riding around without there saftey helmet not done up.
So as the weather warms up the silly season starts and all the idiots will ride around with no cloaths on again.
The point that i want to make is.
If the goverment wont change the law to make people ride with the correct clothing, Should insurance companys refuse cover unless rider and pillion have suitable clothing on. _________________ You make something idiotproof, they'll make a better idiot
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
It`s All in the wrist. |
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Flipper MotoGP Racer
Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5419 Location: Desolation Boulevard
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 11:25 pm Post subject: |
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Cant understand why what other people wear would piss you off?
Seen loads of French Police riders in shirts, freedom of choice is a wonderful thing!! _________________ If you judge people, you have no time to love them. |
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boudicas Kermit
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 2987 Location: Bletchingley, Surrey
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 11:45 pm Post subject: Re: Bike clothing. Poll |
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The Teacher wrote: | Ive been around bike for to many years to mention. There are 2 main things that cheese me of in the bike world.
1 The lack of protective clothing on people riding motorbikes.
2 People riding around without there saftey helmet not done up.
So as the weather warms up the silly season starts and all the idiots will ride around with no cloaths on again.
The point that i want to make is.
If the goverment wont change the law to make people ride with the correct clothing, Should insurance companys refuse cover unless rider and pillion have suitable clothing on. |
I hear ya and agree that there are morons out there that do not waer the correct protective clothing. Kids on scooters come to mind. However, as I use my Bike to comute to and from work I cant say that I wear protective trousers on every journey to and from work. But I do wear gloves, boots, jacket and lid on every trip.
I dont think that laws should be put in place though requiring the wearing of protective clothing (other than lids). They would be far too complex and hard to enforce.
As as far as insurance refusing to pay out - again - I don't think that insurance companies should be given any more reasons to exploit to avoid paying out. Lets face it - with the best of intentions thats what would end up happening.
The only reasonable thing I can think of cant be applied in the UK as refusing to pay out on medical insurance for injuries / treatment that could have been avoided / mitigated by wearing full leathers / textiles and body armor. There is the possibility that the NHS could bill people for the treatment of injuries that could have been mitigated by wearing the proper gear but again this is something would be extremely hard and complex to police and enforce.
I dunno - things are already complicated so its prolly best to leave well alone. _________________ Opinions are like assholes...... Ahhh Fcuk it - YOUR WRONG !!!
Read my Blog at www.mrboudicas.blogspot.co.uk
See my Videos and hear my rants at www.youtube.com/BoudicasUsefulStuff |
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GSEX-SLAPPY Guest
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Posted: Sat May 09, 2009 11:51 pm Post subject: |
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rode today with what i consider less than the bare minimal and that was only as time was of the essence ....had to squeeze in a new front tyre ( remove the wheek to reduce the cost ) and then an MOT which involved changing the can and aquiring new and replacing the Horns ( they wouldnt work every time and when they did only one would sound) so the run to a local Mot tester ( 4 miles ) was made in Helmet , Textile jacket, jeans and trainers ....probably the first time ive worn trainers on a bike since i was a teenager ...felt naked tbh and very very exposed but as said ...it was freedom of choice |
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biggus illitterātus
Joined: 21 Aug 2004 Posts: 31748 Location: Hotel California
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 12:15 am Post subject: |
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Interesting topic. There would be benefit to protective clothing being legislated in, namely, given time, clothing quality should improve if minimum standards were legislated in. However, i do believe in freedom of choice... But one thing that really hacks me off is 'johnny knee down' taking his bint about on the back of his cock rocket wearing an ill fitting lid, slip on shoes, pedal pushers, and flimsy jacket while he's in his one piece leather and 400 quid arai etc.
Interestingly enough... There are different attitudes from different factions - cruiser riders often wear bike jackets but remove the armour for instance.
I wear jeans on occasions, i know the risks etc. My choice etc.. _________________
www.bigguspicus.co.uk
There are 10 types of people in the world: those who understand Binary and those who don't
There are II types of people in the world: those who understand Roman numerals and those who don't.
98% of all Harleys ever sold are still on the road. The other 2% made it home |
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The Teacher Cabbage club member #2
Joined: 17 Mar 2009 Posts: 2118 Location: Playing with traffic
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 12:26 am Post subject: Re: Bike clothing. Poll |
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[quote="boudicas"]
The only reasonable thing I can think of cant be applied in the UK as refusing to pay out on medical insurance for injuries / treatment that could have been avoided / mitigated by wearing full leathers / textiles and body armor. There is the possibility that the NHS could bill people for the treatment of injuries that could have been mitigated by wearing the proper gear but again this is something would be extremely hard and complex to police and enforce.
Good point its one thats been batted about the training industry for a while now. _________________ You make something idiotproof, they'll make a better idiot
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
It`s All in the wrist. |
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The Teacher Cabbage club member #2
Joined: 17 Mar 2009 Posts: 2118 Location: Playing with traffic
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 12:35 am Post subject: |
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I fully respect the fredom of choice. How many people would ride without a saftey helmet on. That change in the law saved thousands of lives over the years. Its also the same with the seat belt law. _________________ You make something idiotproof, they'll make a better idiot
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
It`s All in the wrist. |
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Phoenix 'Phenis the tree hugger'
Joined: 02 Apr 2009 Posts: 2057 Location: op die doos
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 6:13 am Post subject: |
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Informed choice is the thing ...
i DO wear armoured kevlar jeans, boots, textile jacket etc,
but i HAVE paid my insurance company in good faith, knowing
that they have a certain obligation. I know with certainty that they
view that money as theirs and will do anything to avoid giving a penny
of it back, why give them more loopholes.
the stupidity involves in not wearing the correct gear will result in lots
and lots of very very hurty painful ouchy pain in the event of an accident,
is it fair that you will ALSO have the insurance company refusing to fight in
your corner against the Audi driver that pulled out in front of you while
using a cellphone? because for that day only you were on your way to
a bike gear shop to buy new boots ?
freedom of choice ! but Informed choice ! _________________ [img]http://www.boxhill.co.uk/forum/phpBB2/album_pic.php?pic_id=9446[/img]
Semper in merda; sola altitudo variat
Phoenix/Phenis/Treenix/MoP/Kent Trash/David NOT Dave |
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Flintstone Del Boy Deer Hunter
Joined: 25 Nov 2004 Posts: 3988 Location: .........in another world !
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:24 am Post subject: |
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I would rather do things by choice rather than be forced to do them, as I feel you need to educate people as to why we do things as opposed to saying you have to. _________________ It's all down to quality of life ! |
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Athos MotoGP Racer
Joined: 31 Oct 2004 Posts: 6038 Location: climbing out of a big black hole
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:30 am Post subject: |
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Flintstone wrote: | I would rather do things by choice rather than be forced to do them, as I feel you need to educate people as to why we do things as opposed to saying you have to. | yea tell that to your missis _________________ |
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Flintstone Del Boy Deer Hunter
Joined: 25 Nov 2004 Posts: 3988 Location: .........in another world !
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:36 am Post subject: |
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Athos wrote: | Flintstone wrote: | I would rather do things by choice rather than be forced to do them, as I feel you need to educate people as to why we do things as opposed to saying you have to. | yea tell that to your missis |
Well I was thinking about her when I typed it ! _________________ It's all down to quality of life ! |
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GSEX-SLAPPY Guest
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:07 am Post subject: |
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Flintstone wrote: | Athos wrote: | Flintstone wrote: | I would rather do things by choice rather than be forced to do them, as I feel you need to educate people as to why we do things as opposed to saying you have to. | yea tell that to your missis |
Well I was thinking about her when I typed it ! |
Fred wears the trousers in his house........The Missus just TELLS him which ones |
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Tango Sicknote - The Prophet Of Doom
Joined: 30 Dec 2005 Posts: 5854 Location: Looking for a + 10 @ Rising :-0
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:33 am Post subject: Re: Bike clothing. Poll |
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[quote="The Teacher"] boudicas wrote: |
The only reasonable thing I can think of cant be applied in the UK as refusing to pay out on medical insurance for injuries / treatment that could have been avoided / mitigated by wearing full leathers / textiles and body armor. There is the possibility that the NHS could bill people for the treatment of injuries that could have been mitigated by wearing the proper gear but again this is something would be extremely hard and complex to police and enforce.
Good point its one thats been batted about the training industry for a while now. |
Then bill smokers, alcoholics , drug user's etc etc etc . Sorry feller freedom of choice for informed consenting adults . _________________
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Flipper MotoGP Racer
Joined: 19 Jul 2005 Posts: 5419 Location: Desolation Boulevard
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 9:27 am Post subject: |
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The Teacher wrote: | I fully respect the fredom of choice. How many people would ride without a saftey helmet on. That change in the law saved thousands of lives over the years. Its also the same with the seat belt law. |
I agree but think cyclist should have some laws put in place first - Like helmets when on the road!! _________________ If you judge people, you have no time to love them. |
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Jay1 Mini Moto racer
Joined: 11 Oct 2007 Posts: 983 Location: Sutton
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 9:45 am Post subject: |
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See what you're saying but I think it has to be freedom of choice. The most important and obvious piece of safety equipment is already legislated, being the helmet.
As for the insurance companies refusing to pay out I don't see how this could work. It would not be your own insurance company paying you, as you can't claim injury against yourself and also, the amount that "correct clothing" would reduce injury is very subjective. It is agreed that wearing leathers will reduce the risk of injury, but how could you possibly prove that a failure to wear, say an armoured jacket, would have contributed to a broken arm having been knocked off your bike.
I think the only real injuries you could say with any certainty would be reduced by wearing protecive clothing are abbrasion type injuries, and again it is impossible to say that you wouldn't get some road rash in the bargain basement protective gear that would be the bear minimum legal requirement.
If they made the regulations too stiff then the cost of the protective gear would be completely prohibitive to a lot of people, as good quality gear cetainly don't come cheap, particularly if you are having to buy for yourself and a "very occasional" pillion.
Not sure this is a law that could ever realistically be enforced either. Would you want plod pulling every rider they see in jeans over, to check that they are armoured, or kevlar enforced, or whatever the regulations would insist upon?
I don't really understand why anyone would go out on a bike in shorts and t-shirt, and certainly never would myself. But at the end of the day I think that should remain their choice to do so. |
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Baloo Guest
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 10:34 am Post subject: Re: Bike clothing. Poll |
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[quote="tango"] The Teacher wrote: | boudicas wrote: |
The only reasonable thing I can think of cant be applied in the UK as refusing to pay out on medical insurance for injuries / treatment that could have been avoided / mitigated by wearing full leathers / textiles and body armor. There is the possibility that the NHS could bill people for the treatment of injuries that could have been mitigated by wearing the proper gear but again this is something would be extremely hard and complex to police and enforce.
Good point its one thats been batted about the training industry for a while now. |
Then bill smokers, alcoholics , drug user's etc etc etc . |
Unless it can be shown it is not the fault of the user, alchoholic etc, why not? FFS lets all take some responsibility for our actions. If my overweight is due to over eating and my health suffers, than I should take some responsibility, not expect others to pick up the hospital bills etc.
All of this also ignores the affect on loved ones, family etc when someone has an injury, heart attack etc as a result of their "freedom of choice"
I am all for freedom of choice, but not at the expense (fiscal or emotional) of others. |
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southernspeed MotoGP Racer
Joined: 29 Sep 2008 Posts: 4132 Location: Froststead.
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 11:05 am Post subject: |
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Flipper wrote: | Cant understand why what other people wear would piss you off?
Seen loads of French Police riders in shirts, freedom of choice is a wonderful thing!! |
100%. If I wear full leathers, I ride like I have full leathers on. If I have far less on, I ride accordingly. We live in enough of a nanny state. Each to their own. _________________ It's not the speed of life that bothers me, it's the sudden stop at the end!
www.carshaltonmcc.com
www.surreysportsmotorcycles.com
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crazy horse Sink the pink
Joined: 17 Apr 2006 Posts: 1256 Location: London
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 7:56 pm Post subject: |
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Although Freedom of choice is great, can I have the freedom of choice as to wheather treatment for injury caused by taking a slow speed tumble in shorts and trainers gets paid for out of my NI contributions?
I disagree that kit should be legislated, as when you start that ball rolling who knows where It'll end up. As most of us know motorcycling in itself is considered Dangerous by many so would it not eventually become a case that bikes are banned from the public highway for our own safety. _________________ That'll be Mr Horse to you http://www.wmmcc.co.uk/home/index.php/content/view/1/1/1/1/ |
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boudicas Kermit
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 2987 Location: Bletchingley, Surrey
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 8:56 pm Post subject: Re: Bike clothing. Poll |
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tango wrote: | ....Then bill smokers, alcoholics , drug user's etc etc etc . |
MarcBC wrote: |
Unless it can be shown it is not the fault of the user, alchoholic etc, why not? FFS lets all take some responsibility for our actions...... |
I'm with MarcBC on this one totally, I'm a great believer that freedom of choice is is a right that everyone is born with. However, with the freedom of choice we must accept the responsibility and consequences of our free choices.
Steps Off Soapbox for now ..:/ _________________ Opinions are like assholes...... Ahhh Fcuk it - YOUR WRONG !!!
Read my Blog at www.mrboudicas.blogspot.co.uk
See my Videos and hear my rants at www.youtube.com/BoudicasUsefulStuff
Last edited by boudicas on Sun May 10, 2009 9:11 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Suzibabe Vin Diesel
Joined: 09 Aug 2006 Posts: 4178 Location: Wokingham
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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When I first started riding bikes, it was very rare to see anyone in full leathers. Helmet, gloves, boots, leather jacket and jeans was the norm.
My husband rides a Supermoto and wears jeans with a textile jacket. When he had his GSXR750 he wore full leathers.
If I'm going to work I wear leather jeans (non-armoured) and a textile jacket with armour. If I'm out on a ride, I'll wear full leathers.
Freedom of choice! _________________ We are all born mad. Some remain so. ~ Samuel Beckett 1906-1989 |
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reddragon Despatch Rider
Joined: 15 Apr 2009 Posts: 210
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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The Teacher wrote: | I fully respect the fredom of choice. How many people would ride without a saftey helmet on. That change in the law saved thousands of lives over the years. Its also the same with the seat belt law. | |
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moriwaki Fleetwood Mac
Joined: 20 Jan 2007 Posts: 4076 Location: Stuck in the middle.
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Posted: Sun May 10, 2009 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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Funny how ones mind works....
I'm heading out on the ZRX, so, wear leather jeans and jacket, gloves, boots and full face helmet. Reason....because it's what i wear on the bike ! On second thoughts, think i'll go cycling instead. On go shorts, short sleeved top, finger-less track mitts, light weight cycle shoes and cycle helmet.....because it's what i feel comfortable wearing when cycling. More than happy with both.
BUT....falling from a push bike at 40mph is no different to falling from a motorbike at the same speed. Yet, apart from looking stupid, i'd feel naked riding the ZRX in my cycle kit !
If people feel ok riding in jeans, tee-shirts etc then so be it. Not right for most but it's their choice, at a time when we're forever being told what to do and what not to do for our own well being. _________________ Just call me Waki. |
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wivvy's dad Cabbage club member #3
Joined: 13 Apr 2005 Posts: 14655
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Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 5:03 am Post subject: |
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JRTFT |
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pgtips72 Pedestrian
Joined: 07 Nov 2008 Posts: 23
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Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 2:22 pm Post subject: |
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Legislation would also have the effect of aiding the powers that be in further reducing motorcyclists - more expense & compliction etc = fewer new motorcyclists = easier to legislate against- ad infinitum.
I've got all of the gear, I also do instructing now & again. I dont always wear all of the gear when I'm riding for myself tho, that's my choice & I dont have to justify it to anyone.
Decent bike gear has always been expensive (barring the odd amazing bargain here & there), when I started out I knew I couldnt afford top notch stuff so made do with jeans, second hand leather jackets, putting on layers etc & eventually as I got older my ability to buy stuff grew & so did my bike wardrobe.
You've also got to take style (as in type, not fashion) into account to some degree - a lot of my gear is restrictive - great if you're on a sports bike kinda thing but do you really want to be wearing sidi vertigo corsa's on a harley with forward controls? - personally I think the square toed 'biker' boot would be a better option there, helmet wise, if you're sitting a little more laid back then perhaps a full face shoei wont give you as good visibilty as an open face - less protection but it is a trade off for visibility. Would this mean that the cruiser rider wasnt wearing all of the approved gear? _________________ Nope. it's not me, I'm in disguise.... |
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Lil Mush Silent but violent
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3343 Location: Chez les frogs apparently
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Posted: Mon May 11, 2009 2:56 pm Post subject: |
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My answer is (in answer to more than this topic):
ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR THEIR OWN ACTIONS! instead of adding policing yet again...
as Mori said: "at a time when we're forever being told what to do and what not to do for our own well being ". _________________
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